Why Did M.O.P Tank?
Thursday September 24th 2009,
Filed under: Mash Out,Not Your Average,The Unkut Opinion
Written by:

This get me kinda vexed when I read it last night over at XXL:

Foundation, the new disc by M.O.P did not make it into The Billboard 200. According to the Nielsen SoundScan report the disc sold close to 2,100 copies in its debut week.

The fuck? Sure, there’s not a huge market for non-progressive, hardcore rap in these ever trend conscious times, but even KRS-One and Buckshot’s album (which I haven’t even bothered to listen to yet) sold 8,400. While I can’t personally confirm it, I’d bet my kidney that Survival Skills doesn’t have any songs that knock as hard as ‘Blow The Horns’, ‘Bang Time’ or ‘Crazy’. Predictably, Jay-Z sold a bunch of CD’s to Oprah viewers, while Kid Cudi‘s fruit-filled debut sold over 100,000 in it’s first week. Meanwhile, Raekwon has slung an impressive 89,000 units in two weeks, which is both a testament to the power of Wu-Tang Stans worldwide and proof positive that an EMI deal still holds weight. So why didn’t Bill and Fame get any love at the register?

There are a few factors that may have contributed to Foundation not performing as well as hoped:

– Blame KOCH (aka E1 Entertainment). Once known as the old rap graveyard, KOCH managed to carve out a nice little niche for themselves for a while, as well as having a reputation for sharing a far larger slice of the pie with their artists. That was then, however. None of my local chain stores had Foundation on the shelves this week, suggesting that E1 aren’t exactly A-1 in terms of distribution muscle.

– Not Dotting I’s and Crossing T’s. I get the impression that the new M.O.P was just thrown together at the last minute, as it features a few older mixtape tracks, mistakes in the track-listing and production credits and even used incomplete versions of some somngs (like the Premier track that was meant to have scratches on the hook).

– Shout Rap = Not Trendy. As much as it defies imagination, a lot of rap fans can’t fux with screaming on the mic, preferring Whisper Rap or whatever retarded shit is hot right now.

– No Promotion. Other than a couple of interviews and MP3 blasts, there weren’t any V-Blogs or ‘Month of Freestyles’ from the Brownsville duo. Actually, thank fuck there wasn’t.

– Only Broads Buy CD’s. Female Mash-Out fans do exist, but they all boost their music from Best Buy.

– Bad Timing. September has seen some heavy-hitters dropping new product. Maybe the First Family just got lost in the sauce.

– The Intehents? It’s urban legend that M.O.P. tapes are the most stolen rap releases ever, but I’m not sure if downloading is to blame here. It’s safe to say that a lot more people leeched BP3 and Cuban Linx 2.

– People Need Their Effin’ Ears Cleaned Out.

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106 Comments so far
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Look at the amount of online publicity Rae did for Cuban Linx 2 via Twitter, FB etc. Not seen any legwork to that extent from Mash Out.

Comment by DJ Wax On 09.24.09 @

I bought the MOP album. I think they are one of the most consistent groups ever. However….the album didn’t sell because:

1. Not many people knew it was dropping.

2. It was their weakest album in the MOP catalog.

3. OBFCL2, which dropped just a week earlier, is 1000 times better.

I mean really, if you think Foundation is better you need your ears cleaned out. And this is coming from a huge MOP fan. Dont get me wrong, there are about 3 or 4 bangers on the the album. But for the most part it was just mediocore by MOP standards.

Comment by hd 09.24.09 @

Dear M.O.P., Rakim and Capone & Noreaga and all the otherrappers that always say their sales suck because their label made no promotion.

I’m a hiphop journalist, I tryed to get interviews with you guys, and I can tell you one thing. Your label sucks, but the real problem is that you suck TOO !!!

I dont know why you guys arent able to get to do interviews in time and not fucking up the media.

2 min. on MTV America is not enough. You have to talk to every fucking journalist that wants to talk to you, and after that you have to talk to every fucking journalist that doesnt know yet he or she wants to talk to you.

Otherwise you got a album in the market AND NO ONE KNOWS ABOUT IT !!!!!!!

Dear Rob, you are a music lover, a nerd and a fan. You know that the album is coming, but if the artist is doing nothing to promote his product, he will sell and he will earn the exact same thing, nothing.

Artists hate doing interviews, but in these days it as equal important as doing the music, otherwise you do great music for yourself.


Comment by Frank 09.24.09 @


Comment by TYBO2020 09.24.09 @

now should we feel elitist? it’s a mad world.
the album is bangin too hard for the masses.
but i think bill and fizzy are still eatin good.

Comment by swordfish 09.24.09 @

ditto @waxon and also lack of a good single with a proven m.o.p. producer i.e. primo or d.r. period although i have to say the fame produced tracks on the album are dope no question!

Comment by JP 09.24.09 @

Imma go w/Internets, as main reason. Population was still clutchin the pearls ovr Kanye & the Becky and today them niggas is masterbating ovr Em & Slaughterhouse and niggas didnt cop not 2 mufuckin SH CD’s!!!! I GOT MINE 1st FAMILY!!!!

Comment by bboycult 09.24.09 @

Word thats some crazy shit. Regardless the album is still crazy as is every other M.O.P. album. I just hope that this doesnt discourage them from dropping more projects..Its still First Family 4 Life…They def should have sold a lot more than they did. Those number are a little dispresctful to them cats. The most consistent dou out there. Nobody can name one album that didnt impress.

Comment by CientifiQ 09.24.09 @

I didn’t even know they had a new project out until right now.

Comment by Ape 09.24.09 @

Fucking crazy. I made sure i had to buy a copy. There really is not an excuse. I got my copy, day of, at a best buy in KALAMAZOO, MICHIGAN!!!!! You mean i’m one of only 2000 cats that bought it??? I wonder how many new yorkers bought it… Shit everyone in brownsville should atleast have a copy.

Comment by P. Wil 09.24.09 @

Could be that Raekwon still tapped into old-fashioned, magazine-reading, music-buying fans (he was on the cover of The Fader, and in most other music mags) whereas MOP, er, didn’t.

That or the fact that no one seemed to even know it was being released.

Not really sure ‘internet fans’ ever translate into sales.

Comment by bboyclause 09.24.09 @

I agree with JP. The album’s nice, but IMHO not only does it lack a certified banger that stands on top of the rest (and some undergound A-level producers), but it sounds a bit samey to me. I don’t know, really…
Oh, well, add that to the fact that it’s the first proprer release in 9 years and me, personally, I was a bit disappointed.

In any case, 2100 copies are a joke no matter the album’s flaws, there’s no denying that.

Comment by reiser 09.24.09 @

A Clarification: It’s really just about the overall bitchassness of the male public persona these days… I work w/social workers and therapists and they would NEVER come outright and say “Yo this asshole, this asshole needs to get his wig slapped off!!!” That’s why I’m constantly @ odds w/this era, I listen to M.O.P
M.O.P is “slap a asshole’s wig off” music. PERIOD.

Comment by bboycult 09.24.09 @

Lets Be Honest. Have you seen a recent video of these dudes? They looking like my beat up drunk great uncle. No 18 yr old is gonna be checking for an underpromoted under produced unfinished LP from dudes who look like they should be sipping tea on a porch but are screaming about guns and the hard knock life.
I’d rather buy warriors again.

Comment by Benhameen 09.24.09 @

Survival Skills has a Mary J. Blige feature. Word to the wise for Mash Out’s next album… *shudders*

Comment by Ivan 09.24.09 @

Karma came back and bit MOP in the wallet. Shouldn’t steal beats…

Comment by CMJ 09.24.09 @

i think the promotion really sucked….also, maybe billy & fame got too comfortable with their “our fanbase is so strong we can drop anytime and sell 100k” mantra…
but with that being said i love dem guys and have all their cd’s except ghetto warfare or whatever it was called…

Comment by D-DAY 09.24.09 @

At least I’m one of the 2,100. Makes it feel personal. The promotion was terrible. No internet presence at all. And that’s what’s needed today with people having attention spans of a nanosecond. I happened to see it behind the counter at Fatbeats so I copped. Dudes I know that fuck with MOP had no clue they even had an album out. In order to stay above water they need to get their online savvy up. Or at least their management team.

Comment by HowfreshEats 09.24.09 @

I actually feel bad for downloading and banging this shit 24/7

Comment by CENZI 09.24.09 @

MOP in the Skinny Leg Era = FAIL

Comment by P-Matik 09.24.09 @

fuck the world..i got my copy & im playin that shit hard.I looong ago realized people full o’ shit when it comes to music(really life),they’ll bump whateva they friends is bumping,they too afraid to like whateva they like & let it be known


Comment by dj blendz 09.24.09 @

Did they even have a proper single with a video?

Comment by Eastern_Digital 09.24.09 @

promotion could be a factor, but also maybe the group didnt make the BEST music possible. I mean, Raekwon did his respective #’s but his album is also great. Hell, even Shit 97 is playing it here in the city.

Comment by Brian B.Dot Miller 09.24.09 @

True Indeed Gotta admit one of nigga who download it gotta say shit bang hard that and the Beanie Sigel.

Comment by CashRlue 09.24.09 @

– Not Dotting I’s and Crossing T’s. I get the impression that the new M.O.P was just thrown together at the last minute, as it features a few older mixtape tracks, mistakes in the track-listing and production credits and even used incomplete versions of some somngs (like the Premier track that was meant to have scratches on the hook).”

you answered your question. also why I wont be buying this album. I’ll download maybe but why shoulld I give my hard earned money to a half-assed effort.

Comment by CMJ 09.24.09 @

damn this shit got me heated, M.O.P. dropped one of the hottest albums of the year and it ain’t like people don’t know it was out. shit like this with “fans” not supporting will lead to great artists stop making albums at all or stop putting time and effort to make GOOD albums. anyone feeling this and banging that shit off your harddrive: A BIG FUCK YOU!

Comment by claaa7 09.24.09 @

ask yourself this ” how many people are like you” who bang hardcore shit. Think about this, who buys cds? mainly girls. them niggas didnt even promote. i heard about them niggas when fizzy jack that nigga beat. they been on all the great labels, i mean you mean to tell me you on g-unit records and you still cant put a record out? i didnt know the shit was out…peace
that shit aint crack, it aint gonna sell itself.

Comment by paychexx 09.24.09 @

thats crazy and sad that they sold so little, i wonder if itunes makes a big difference? i can’t remember if soundscan counts that or not, i don’t think they do, honestly, i just don’t have the money to cop this album right now, or the new antipop consortium or ob4cl2 even though i am a big rae stan, plus i just spent my monies on a new tv, and about to cop a new celly on that android tip, most teenagers just buy a song or two off of itunes these days, its the era of downloading singles, if it ain’t the new flash in the pan teeny bopper mtv attention deficit shit, it just don’t fly, which is really terrible for the hip hop heads who want dudes like MOP and their distinguished colleagues [irony] to stay in the game

Comment by gstatty 09.24.09 @

Sales figures are for homos.
even if an act sells half a mil it doesnt mean the people that bought it thought it was good.
also, this ‘first weeks sales’ thing that XXL seem to live and die by is fucking gay.
if you’re hitting 5 0s these days its more than just Hip Hop fans buying your stuff

Comment by step one 09.24.09 @

C’mon, Robbie, be honest with yourself: I know you love them and true school critics do too, but MOP have never sold records like that. Their nadir was Ante Up and inexplcibaly Cold As Ice was a hit in the UK too but that was a long time ago.

Their fanbase is a lot smaller than the miilion-plus OB4Cl fans and related fanatical Wu-cult Rae could tap into. Plus Rae did put in mad promo legwork. Think of all the interviews and performnace he did. Like you noted, MOP didn’t do close to any of that and their marketing even fell short of what KRS and Buck did for Survival Skills (videos, interviews, BTS clips, trailers etc). Between virtually no work by MOP and them not being that big to begin with, the big chains (what’s left of them, that is) like Best Buy, Wal-mart and Target were never gonna take in tonnage on this album. Taking all that into account, the results are not that surprising. And be clear, downloading ain’t the reason this album tanked either – please believe that PLENTY of people download Cudi’s joint and he still moved units. MOP have to a take a hard look at themselves and ecide if they want to work harder to turn their connoisseurs’ rap buzz into a real & lucrative career because being rappers’ and rap critics’ favorite group is not a way to make a real living!

Comment by ian aka @StellasKid 09.24.09 @

The answer is a pretty simple one: MOP’s music has suffered since their last good album, Warriorz. Since then they had signed to the Roc, then G-Unit, and also released a couple of random CD, but the music isn’t at the same level that it used to be. Sure, it’s still aggressive in nature, but nothing on the new album compares to ANYTHING from the first four albums, all of which I consider to be classic material. Something is missing and I say it starts with the actual music production.

Comment by bc-tw 09.24.09 @

This is an insightful piece. Obviously, there are A LOT of MOP fans that commented in this section. Sure, the label is to blame and that is an easy way out. Look at Slaughterhouse, they did A LOT of self promotion to get their names and faces out there. Granted, they didn’t sell much (@18,000) in their first week, but there is a big buzz out there for them. Labels now, more or less, just distribute music and promotion seems to fall back more on the artists. I agree and it seems to be a mystery why a physical release does not make it to Best Buy. That is almost like a digital release not making it to iTunes. Also, Premier has to get back more on beats and on the Executive Producing role, too.

Comment by SPank (Divided Souls Ent) 09.24.09 @


First off they the realest dudes you will ever meet, I lived near Sarotoga in Brownsville, and these dudes are just regular dudes.

Right now people are attracted to stars,thats why jay sold, he is a star, Drake did 72k for a cd that he gave away free 7 months ago, it is about what people see,

M.O.P should sign to Roc Nation and only do tours, forget new music, your fans are your fans, hit the nation, I know if they hit;

Detroit, Gary,IN, Newark, Camden, New Orleans, Decatur, Boston, Providence, Philly, Jersey City, Brooklyn, Bronx, Queens, Harlem, Staten Island, Long Island, Scranton,PA, Baltimore, DC,

Just to name a few, sale the CD as part of the cover charge like Prince did, instead of 15 for shows, say 25 and give away CD, that counts as a purchase

Get Going

Comment by The Editor 09.24.09 @

“Kid Cudi’s fruit-filled debut” Damn.

Comment by rILES 09.24.09 @

Bad timing if there ever was. Plus, this was not a strong enough push considering the long hiatus they took since the last official Long Play.

Nevertheless, I hope Billy and Fame keep their focus and get behind their own album. Start touring ASAP if they haven’t started already. No one can resist a live M.O.P. show; if you haven’t seen one yet you are missing one of the best shows on earth.

They’re gonna have to promote this album the old fashion way.

Comment by Ausar 09.24.09 @

im loyal to m.o.p. but this cd wasnt what i hoped it to be!!! 14 songs ,7 shouldve gone to premier bcuz he brings the best out of these dudes!!!

Comment by gabzilla 09.24.09 @

First of all, “Survival Skills” is a much much better album than “Foundation” is – I still don’t get it how most of ya’ll feel that positive about it. M.O.P used to make decent 3,5-4 mics albums, but that one right here is around 2-2,5…
“Foundation” = M.O.P’s weakest album with wannabe crossover attempts and it failed hard on sales – whatta irony

Of course the reason for those weak numbers is probably smth else – more likely lack of promotion and who knows what

Comment by Blanco 09.24.09 @

To those who don’t rate the new MOP – check out Crazy feat. Termanology, produced by Statik Selektah. One of my tunes of ’09!

Comment by chjake 09.24.09 @

i thought the beats on the album were lacking that special something but it should still do better than that,.. maybe a lot of people dont even know it dropped yet. i dont recall seeing any advertisement for it.

Comment by RowanB 09.24.09 @

Whisper Rap. Funny.

Comment by Combat Jack 09.24.09 @

Didnt know the exact release but I saw it on i-tunes copped it its a banger (although all the songs are misnamed) i dont think kids even know who MOP is. every time they had a buzz they got fucked over and then they go indy with no buzz

Comment by g in dmv 09.24.09 @

im going to buy foundation as soon as i can find it in my area as I will always support m.o.p just as a thanks for there back catalog if nothing else but yeah, beats on new album are weak. the fame production is the best of it. foundation is the worst m.o.p track i ever set eaRS on. W.T.F.

i think ob4cl2 is selling that much more because its better. soon as i heard the leak i pre ordered the cd, that said is teh soundscan international? cos i rekon m.o.p would do better in europe/japan than states.

Comment by gx 09.24.09 @



Comment by AO HAMALIN 09.24.09 @

soundscan is US only.
im curious as to the ratio of illegal downloads to actual sales is as you KNOW more than 2100 people have this album.

Comment by step one 09.24.09 @

We are talking about rappers from the 90’s who weren’t even as big as RAEKWON…please someone do the math for Robbie. ha ha….NO One cares about this shit. BTW MOP is the shit but my 15 year old cousin whos named PARRISH doesnt know who his father named him after. He thought it was the dude from the celtics. This post doesnt even need to be here. MAN FANS yayyyyyy!!!!!

Comment by Mercilesz 09.24.09 @

We could throw out all kinds of theories… but honestly, it really just boils down to a lack of interest and a lack of support by their “fans”. I know M.O.P. isn’t the most mainstream group there is and never have been, but I know they have more than 2100 fans. So why hasn’t it sold more than 2100 copies?

It’s just like Questlove said on his Myspace blog back when blogging on Myspace had an inkling of relevance. He noted that the Roots’ sales were far lower than the number of people who are ‘friends’ on the fan page, lower than the number of people who say they love the Roots so much, lower than the number of people who’ll blame Def Jam for lack of promotion but still haven’t bought the album THEMSELVES.

Same thing with M.O.P. If people want an album, they WILL go out and buy it. Or they’ll download it, while being upset that their favorite artists aren’t popular. But either way, their sales mean one of two things- either A) nobody cares about this album or B) those who do care, cared so much they downloaded it and therefore didn’t purchase it.


Comment by DANJ! 09.24.09 @

What’s to say that it won’t sell that same amount for a number of weeks? If it does, it will end up with decent sales. First week sales are retarded anyway. It came out on the same day as Survival Skills, which was $7.99 at Best Buy, and it was about $14.99. Which one am I going to buy at that point? I will still be getting it, but will wait until I see it for a little cheaper elsewhere, or until I have a coupon.

Comment by HipHopHistorian 09.24.09 @

“Shout Rap = Not Trendy. As much as it defies imagination, a lot of rap fans can’t fux with screaming on the mic”

I seem to recall you using that exact same phrase(“shout rap”) to explain why you didn’t care for Run DMC back in the days, and preferred the smooth flow of cats like Rakim.
“The more things change…” or something?

Comment by Werner von Wallenrod 09.24.09 @

What promotion have they done? I didn’t see much online and saw zero promo in the street. The world is bigger than NYC.

Also, this album cover/title is pretty interchangeable with everything else they’ve put out. If I was browsing in a store I’d think it was a compilation or an old album.

With that said, I haven’t heard or seen either member of MOP talking about the album. Gotta let the people know that this is an official product that you are sanctioning and not some mixtape that someone is trying to pass off as a new album. There’s alot of those “Howie McDuffie Music Group” albums on iTunes that are just mixtapes. People don’t wanna feel like idiots for paying for something that people get 3 for 5 at the barbershop

Comment by thrillhouse 09.24.09 @

Robert Parish is the Chief though

Comment by keatso 09.24.09 @

The last album I found worth my time and money was FF4L … after that, deeeeeeeert….

Comment by AC 09.24.09 @

As a HipHopHistorian you should know rap releases almost always have their biggest sales week first week and almost never sell at a consisent level over the long run unless they cross over and go mega-pop a la Black Eyed Peas, Lil Wayne and T.I. or Eminem and Nelly during their peak commercial eras.

Comment by ian aka @StellasKid 09.25.09 @

robbie, “survival skills” is banging hard too!

Comment by Benson 09.25.09 @

I don’t think you give downloading enough ‘credit’ as a contributing factor towards this album’s major fail.

Though I’m yet to hear it myself, my impression so far has been that the internet has gone nothing short of nuts over its apparent high quality. Yet only 2,100 people actually bought it? That’s messed up.

Yeah, promotion was poor, and yeah, you quite rightly point out that more people probably downloaded this year’s major label releases – which still managed to sell sufficient number of legal copies – but what has particularly annoyed ME about M.O.P.’s poor sales is the sheer level of critical acclaim the album has been given.

It’s about time people started spending a couple of dollars if they ‘love’ albums so much.

– A female Mash-Out fan who doesn’t buy my music @ Best Buy 😉

Comment by Sarah 09.25.09 @

uh. there’s no single.

Comment by eric 09.25.09 @

Honestly yall people need to wake up. Do you really think their form of rapping is needed anymore. People talk shit about em , jay-z and nas all the time. About how their style needs change or evolve . But MOP hasn’t changed in the last 20 years let be serious here. They fucking sound the same. We can sit here and lie to our self. About how they didn’t get enough promo and all that other nonsense. But the true fact of the matter is nobody wants to hear two 40 year old grown man. Talk about stomping people out and shooting people while screaming at the top of their lungs anymore. Plain and fucking simple!

I love old school hip hop. But I love when artist evolves with the times as well. MOP has never did it for me. They have had a couple of joints . But over all they are too old to be rapping like there fucking mine age (26). They need to take those classic they got and tour for those hardcore fans. Cause they won’t make it this music industry with their albums….this shit just proves it

Comment by SP 09.25.09 @

“We”, meaning fans, are also the problem.
The industry is reactive, not proactive so it CANT develop, create or nurture the culture, only keep it “alive”…to make profit…
What hip hop has done is become another face of pop music.
And pop fans/ the pop world is shallow…now look at us…we act just like them…dress like them…go by their rules damn near…all of out media outlets are damn near the same…same fans…
We forgot how to relax and enjoy music just like them pop junkies.
just buy it!
allow yourself to like who you like without feeling guilty or weird!
stop looking to see whos fuckin with it too,
stop speculating,
stop overanalyzing,
who cares if its not on the radio!
who cares if its not selling!
how can it sell if it never had a chance to begin with?
Some of the best shit IS NOT on the radio, remember those days? I mean WTF happened to US?
back in the day if you liked an artist, you just bought his new shit!
no blogging, no big hooplaa, no “marketing”, no excuses you just went and fuckin bought it…
we dont dont that anymore…
lets face it, artist cant even be artist anymore…WE wont let them…
they have to be hybrids to survive because “real hip hop” is dead and WE the fans have gotten stupid…music has no value anymore, its just another hustle…
Too many dudes have to go out of character just to compete…
oversaturated, underappreciated = Hip Hop.

Comment by Ay! 09.25.09 @

Another reason could be the scarcity of stores that carry the album. For instance, it hasn’t been released on iTunes in Europe yet. I’m still waiting for a chance to buy the album from iTunes.

Comment by Martin 09.25.09 @

SP speaks truth.

Comment by DANJ! 09.25.09 @

Keatso ur bugged out…ha ha. But His father who is well into his 40’s by now was a dj back in the day and named him after PMD and my cuz has no idea who PMD is.I was just trying to make the point that Sp so eloquently made above. All this shit can come out but its pay for play now not kiss it or diss it or pump it or dump it(my ny radio headz get it). Theres no quality control and kids will listen to anything if u shove it down their throats long enuff. pause.

Comment by Mercilesz 09.25.09 @

oh i got a new one…”No Pedo”….yall can use that. Thats 4 yall

Comment by Mercilesz 09.25.09 @



Comment by mac DIESEL 09.25.09 @

I chose NOT to buy this album when I heard the story about the beat for “Rude Bastards”. Apparently the beat has been made by a dude named Kil and NOT by Fizzy Womack. All production credit has gone to Fizzy Womack however and none to Kil.
Unacceptable if you ask me! Give at least the proper credit to the right people!

Comment by Fresh Rotation 09.25.09 @

I have to co-sign what SP said.

Comment by DRLROCKWELL 09.25.09 @

SP. 26 year olds arent screaming thier raps though are they? there mumbling about there aramani sunglasses and thier designer tights and shit. So if you think about it M.O.P are rapping there age.

No one really likes evolving rappers anyway. Everyone wants nas to do a illmatic remake and look what takingit back to his raw shit has done for raekwons sales.

Comment by gx 09.25.09 @

@Gx I understand what you meant. But not all rappers around my age are rapping like that. Budden is 29 which is around my age bracket. There is mcs saying something. That grew up on the biggies , the pacs and nas. Im just saying MOP is fucking utterly annoying these days. No fucking subtance in there raps. I aint telling dudes to dress up like hova. But im also tried of hearing about some Old Gangstas talking about how ima get the “Lima for drama” while yelling BANG in the background ! Its like people are scared to say they felt off and they are out of touch . Aint nobody drinkin 40tys anymore my dude. And the ones that are , are old ass bum niggas that in a peter pan world day dreaming on the block. Fucking “never never landing it “. Anyways I know these niggas aint trying to switch up their style or at least trying to surprise there fans. So I say they are through…until well it is over offically. Unless these old dogs got some new tricks. Which I don’t believe cause they like 14 albums deep and shit aint change.

Comment by sp 09.25.09 @

i bought 2 copies of that shit the night before it came out at fat beats in ny. the fact that sales are low is because people are fuckin suckers. enough said . MOP salute! real hip hop

Comment by bamford 09.25.09 @

but the music isn’t at the same level that it used to be. Sure, it’s still aggressive in nature, but nothing on the new album compares to ANYTHING from the first four albums!


Comment by truht 09.25.09 @

i don’t get it.why does every artist gotta move with times evolve and switch sounds?i think it’s aight when they stick to they script.there are nuff styles for every listener to choose from.and for me the ruggedness still huge factor.

Comment by swordfish 09.25.09 @

Maybe the shit just sucked. Didn’t think of that one…

Comment by That Dude 09.26.09 @

@step one – good point, I can actually get the illegal versus legal downloads data (by every city in the world if I want) Ima check that out

And to the people saying they should just do shows. How do you think shows are funded? Its not exclusively sales but thats a part of it plus not breaking the top 200 doesnt do much for an artists appeal as a live act to promoters do it

Sales arent a makr of quality, but they’re still important to an artists all round career

Comment by Jeffluv 09.26.09 @

Well I bought it, but I can’t get enough of that shouty shit. I can’t work out why anyone would like Jay-Z or Cudi over the Mash Out Posse. What’s the point of Cudi anyways?

Comment by Mag7Music 09.26.09 @

Every M.O.P album has three or four shitty songs…but the dope songs on ‘Foundation’ stand-up against anything in their discography.
Anyone who doesn’t fuck with ‘Bang Time’ or ‘I’m A Brownsvillian’ needs to jump in front of an express bus.

Comment by Robbie 09.26.09 @

How about we didn’t buy it because WE’VE BEEN BURNED TOO MANY TIMES?!?!?!?!

That last REAL M.O.P. album that dropped was 2000’s “Warriorz.” Since then what have we had? “The Marksmen,” “Salutes the St. Marqsmen” etc. ALL GARBAGE.

So when I see a new M.O.P. album being promoted with no video and just one or two leaked songs and that awful cover, of course I think it’s going to suck and I don’t want to get burned again.

It took me no less than five co-signs from tastes I respect to buy the record and, despite not a SINGLE track had the correct tracklisting, I think it’s great.

So while it may not be B&F’s fault for all those awful releases, I’ve seen no proof of this finally dope one being any different.

Comment by pileofshirt69 09.26.09 @

good ass album

Comment by gigolo tony 09.26.09 @

I’m an M.O.P. fan so I knew it was coming, but who really knew? No fliers, interviews, videos (forever and always needs a visual), there was no promotion at all. ANd you can’t find it in stores. I went to cop it, and gave up and downloaded it, real talk. Its sad cause it bangs harder than anything out right now. Although the fruit album by Cudi is oddly nice. Oddly.

Comment by Del 09.26.09 @

“Anyone who doesn’t fuck with ‘Bang Time’ or ‘I’m A Brownsvillian’ needs to jump in front of an express bus.”

Thank you…The same people here talkin about MOP need to ‘evolve’and switch sounds will be the same ones screaming how they sound soft and need to ‘take it back’.Be real

Comment by dj blendz 09.26.09 @

I think stealing MOPs music is a fitting tribute in a way. Im gonna go wait outside fatbeats and rob some kid for it.

Comment by keatso 09.26.09 @

@dj blendz I hope you aint the real one. Cause if you are your ass in outta pocket. But I doubt it. Anyways , nobody should take any thing back negrative or positive . Hopefully they read this shit and take it for a lesson. Instead of a insult. If you sold 2000 units when your album been out for a month. It is obivious something wrong. Yall take rappers selling records as a damn taboo. So what about nas? I bet yall half ass hip hop aint got shit to say. When yall dogged him out him for jumping to a new topic. When he is just showing growth as a man and a lyricist. Give me a break get the fuck out that dream day world. Hip hop is about talk the current struggles and show progression over time. The reason why some rappers are happy with not selling album. Cause they are too scared to do something new. Probably for the fact that they don’t know any better or they choose not to want to experience new things. Which is a house nigga trait . Aint no grown man on here can tell me they taught the same way at 18 and their 30 now …fuck outta here.

Im done with this subject…thanx for reading

Comment by sp 09.26.09 @

Exactly Keatso…you don’t buy MOP music, you steal it..Ante up

Comment by BIGSPICE 09.26.09 @

Because there’s good boom bap, and there’s mindnumbing tuneless bullshit that people not familiar with rap stereotype the whole genre as. AKA this.

try hard rugged rap fans are the new backpackers

Comment by Vast Skinny Jeans Conspiracy 09.26.09 @

@sp homey it aint that serious i was just stating my opinion,it wasn’t directed at any one single person.


Comment by dj blendz 09.26.09 @

pssst…*whispers* It’s because these niggas music is hot boo boo trash.

Comment by Elephant-in-the-Room 09.26.09 @

they needed more promo/presence…us folks who check this blog and comment on it are pretty dedicated hip hop fans…some peoples radars dont go that deep. they work a job go home and bump whatever theyve heard about, its not always the fans fault if they dont hear of it…like pharoahe probably doesnt have as bigger fanbase as mop once dide but everyone in the world knew when he was dropping desire there was hype and anticipation…same with raekwon every body knew…m.o.p just slipped under the radar, not due to their product…but wheres the big tour announcements a couple dope film clips…street buzz i didnt hear/see it. of course all of us here are gonna scratch our heads and wonder whats up cos we check for their shit but for the everyday person that probably doesnt happen.

Comment by dialect 09.26.09 @

Kid Cudi’s album is not ” fruit filled ” you ignorant, old dumb son of a bitch.
Its one of the most honest hip hop albums of all time and its definitley ahead of its time.


Comment by afra 09.27.09 @

^ Cudi’s shit is self-indulgent, pretentious, emo trash. Kinda like El-P’s first solo record, if you think about it.

Comment by Robbie 09.27.09 @

These two faggots flopped because they’re wack.

Comment by JT 09.27.09 @

I Cant Say Enuf Good Things About MOP..If Its Not One Of Their Full Length Albums..Then Its One Of the Million and One Features They’ve Done For W/ Other Artists Or For Dj Mixtapes…These People On Here Saying MOP Needs To Change or EVOLVE Their Music R Sum Closed Minded Fools..MOP Would Rather Sell Nothin & Hang It Up For Good Than Change Their Style Up For Pussy Niggas..These Niggas R Consistent Cuz They Know Their Strengths & Thats Wut They Rock W/..As Far As That Goes Though..Its Been Said More Than Once Even By 50 That Lately FAME’s Lyrical Game Is Less Than so-so..his hungers gone and he really sounds like he jus done care anymore..While Billy’s Actually Stepped His Game Up..I Hope They Dont Stop..But If They Do..They Stop As Legends

Comment by PA's Own 09.27.09 @

I love MOP great live show this album blows and Ob4cl 2 is classic

Comment by bg1313 09.27.09 @

I’m a little too broke to cop any album right now, but as soon as I can I’mma get Billy Danze and Lil Fames newest. From what I’ve heard, shit is dope and worth my money. The record industry is wack as is the buying public, so fuck basing any opinion on what they think.

Comment by watty clarke 09.28.09 @

It is not a dope album, thats why noones buying it.I mean lyrics and delivery is on point as always but the beats? no way to mash out people on those beats, no way.

Comment by PAS 09.28.09 @

the album is cold, not on the levs of the previous lps but its def holding some bangers! MOP arent to everyones tastes so that plus no promo, single etc…its not hard to see why its only sold 2k

Comment by Mo 09.28.09 @

1.) Lack of BIG chart single or video

2.) 9 (NINE!) years sonce the last proper album

3.) Illegal Downloads

4.) Bad release timing

Comment by Question Marc 09.29.09 @

M.O.P. is one of my all time fave groups. from “To The Death” to “Warriors” they kept upgrading their dope. Ante Up and Cold As Ice were big singles and they should have been precursors of big things. then they tried to sign to labels whose brands are more famous then the groups they sign and…you know the rest. Their fan base sure didn’t expand in the last 9 years. and the energy in their music is not what it used to be. it doesn’t help that the industry has almost entirely collapsed. Billy and Fame spent their peak years in record label purgatory and weren’t unable to fructify those situations in any way. i heard them say that beeing with 50 they were able to clear all their debts. however in the “Foundation” cd sleeve it says appearing curtesy of g-unit…

Comment by BL 09.30.09 @

I saw it pop up for download & that was the first time I even heard about a new MOP album.. I heard Fame had a solo coming out but nothing about the new album.. I downloaded the shit thinking, here we go, yet another random compilation.. The artwork wasn’t anything new OR special.. I was shocked to hear all new tracks.. Sharks in the water Track 12, is my shit… I’m gonna go & see if Jb’s stocking it.. I kinda doubt it.
In closing, I blame the sheer lack of Publicity & cunts like me who downloaded the shit thinking it was some mixtape-ish. 2000 records sold is Sad as fuck, They’ll get my purchase, when I find the shit.. This is is in Richmond should be stocking this. i’m out.

Comment by matt bane 09.30.09 @

Nobody wants to listen to two 40-year old faggots who are STILL rapping about robbing people or handing out beatdowns. It’s time to move on.

Comment by JT 09.30.09 @

The Raekwon number would have been way higher if you could actually find a copy anywhere. I had friends all over the world having trouble finding a copy at their local.

EMI and sleeping retailers; ball officially dropped.

Comment by J$ 09.30.09 @

Honestly I tried to get the album several times but I couldn’t find it at any store. They had tons of Raekwons and tons of the new Krs & buckshot but not one fuckin MOP copy. When i tried to get it from amazon or another online shop they said the shipping would take 13 days so i was like fuck it…

even itunes didn’t have it!

I didn’t like the album that much anyway, I just wanted to support the group cuz i was a fan from day one but if they can’t get their shit together and fuck up their whole distribution then I’m not willing to waste my time lookin for their shit.

Comment by Asanto 10.01.09 @

Koch lost their distro in oz. That’s why you couldn’t buy it in the store, dummy.

Comment by P 10.02.09 @

Poor Fizzy Wo…

Comment by Rudiman Mouse 10.03.09 @

always been a fan of M.O.P since the “How about some hardcore” days but to say this is one their best albums is straight bs , they fell off in a big way .The reason why the first couple of albums worked so well was the crazy beats Premo gave em but this is some low-low-dated-no-vibe crap beats on this album if you gonna do shouting and screaming rap the dam beats gotta bo on point or its just sounding stupid and boring… i didnt know they where releasing this album either none whats so ever promotion for this album . it’s a shame that the old rappers never get the beats they deserve nowdays, if they only reached out to the younger generation NOT in US tho but to the heads out in Europe who still know how to do that propper non watered down boom bap sh*t with a fresh approach , instead of trying to do their own beats cuz they dont have a budget to get Premo , Pete Rock beats anymore… thoughts?

Comment by Frankenstein 10.03.09 @

All i know is that OB4CL2 go so hard i listen to it everyday. There is no album that goes harder this year, Rae, has not lost a step he still paints that vivid picture 4 ya like on the song fat lady sings i only wished he would have gave me 1ne more verse. Mop will always be one of my favorites long live real hiphop.

Comment by brolly 10.03.09 @

my love is for the music and i hope the artist’s is too so critcs don t really change anything m.o.p kill ,raekwon kills,rakim allah and the rest of you know what’s real hip hop kills and cause we’re here and going no where waitin for that next TRACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Comment by SAO 10.16.09 @

I have no idea what these hater dudes are talking about. It’s no masterpiece, but it’s far from trash. I finally got around to listening to the whole thing through today. The standouts are: “Bang Time”- hard as fucc – and “Forever and Always” – hip-hop brilliance. Statik Selecta is way underrated. He has a golden ear. The rest of the joint is totally soild. The only real stumble is the auto-tune “Street Life” nonsense that Koch pushed them into.

Although this may sound like blasphemy, the more laid back street life tales are sounding better to me than the wild out MOP. I think they perfected riot starting shout rap in the Warriors era. An older MOP still gets live, but sounds better when it’s contrasted with a moody track, rather than trying to recapture “Ante Up” type of magic. I’d love to hear them 1) focus more on moody tracks. 2) do a whole album with Statik Selecta.

Comment by Thermos 12.10.09 @

This was CD only. Me and a lot of other people don’t even consider CD only an official album release. It’s more like a mixtape if they can’t even be bothered to press it up on wax. I own almost everything MOP ever released. On wax. I’m a big fan. But I don’t pay money for CDs, that’s the wack. It would have sold better if it was wax only. MOP fans aren’t CD heads. Kids don’t buy MOP.

Comment by T 12.16.09 @

^are you an idiot? Check ITunes

M.O.P. said in a interview during the hype of Warriorz that they didn’t care for the money and didn’t spend it for more then common needs, like plumbing and electricity, so they don’t care about the record sales. The album itself was a bit rushed, but overrall it was pretty good.

Comment by Lil Econem 01.11.10 @

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