Kill That Noise – Rap Rumors That Don’t Matter
Wednesday April 14th 2010,
Filed under: Features,The Unkut Opinion
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You could be excused for believing that I spend every waking hour obsessing over rap trivia while preparing for my next interview with an obscure hip-hop character, but that’s not really the case. Admittedly, a lifetime of perusing linear notes and thumbing through old rap magazines can tend to have some unwanted side-effects, but beyond my search for the lost TJ Swan album, there are – in the words of Zev Love X – more than ‘two on my list of shit I don’t give a fuck about’ when it comes to popular hip-hop folklore.

1. The ‘T.R.O.Y.’ controversy – Having spoken to both parties involved, I refuse to indulge this petty feud any further. Even if Large Professor’s dear old mother gave him the Tom Scott record for his 16th birthday and Pete faked an asthma attack so that he could steal it while Paulie ran off to call 911, I just don’t care.

2. Likewise when Pete played ‘Juicy Fruit’ for Biggie. Oh, Puff figured out he could make the same record without paying you? Welcome to the music business, guy.

3. Freddie Foxxx not turning up for the ‘Eric B. Is President’ session – Big deal. He eventually made an album with Eric – which it had it’s moments – but didn’t exactly feature anything of the caliber of ‘My Melody’, did it?

4. Rakim’s Lost Big Daddy Kane Diss Track– After attempting to confirm the existence of ‘Break The Wrath In Half’, it was recently revealed in Angus Batey’s HHC interview with The R that there were but six bars aimed at Dark Gable in the original version of ‘Let The Rhythm Hit ‘Em’. Bit of a let-down, really.

5. Which Beats Did Marley Marl Really Make? This was interesting for a minute until it became clear that every rapper that he ever worked with considers taking a few records into the studio ‘producing’. If you didn’t touch the sampler or the drum machine, you didn’t produce shit.

6. Eric B. Ran Kool G Rap Out Of New York – Go directly to jail. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200.

7. K-Solo Stole ‘Spellbound’ from DMX While In Jail – Based on Dark Man X’s recent antics, I’d say his version of events is about as trust-worthy as a Jerry Heller record contract.

8. KRS-One Didn’t Throw PM Dawn Off The Stage – Technically, BDP heavy ICU punched Prince Be and Just-Ice pushed him off the stage, but I guess that doesn’t sound as good.

9. Anything Jaz-O Says About His ‘Son’ Jay-Z – Let it go, duke.

10. Nas Recording With Any Of The Illmatic Producers Again – If you’re still waiting for Illmatic Volume 2 then you need to get out the house more. It’s no longer 1994 and lightening doesn’t strike twice.

A version of this piece was originally published in Hip-Hop Connection Digital 001.

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37 Comments so far
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Maybe, but nothing would be better than Nas doing an album with those dudes again – Primo, Pete, Large – they all still got it, so it would definitely be better than anything post-Illmatic

Comment by Blanco 04.14.10 @

a relatively unknown hip hop “rumor”…

Big Pun and Jadakiss were going to engage in a “beef” shortly before Pun died to boost their respective album sales.

Jada recorded his “diss” to Pun, but Pun died before he could record his diss.

The Jada record allegedly exists…

Comment by D 04.14.10 @

Maybe, but nothing would be better than Nas doing an album with those dudes again – Primo, Pete, Large – they all still got it, so it would definitely be better than anything post-Illmatic
Comment by Blanco 04.14.10 @

^^dude, get over it already. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN!

Comment by Marc Oz 04.14.10 @

G Rap didn’t get chased out of NY by Eric B but he did he get chased out of NY but real gangsters for snitching. He moved to Arizona, now he lives near Atlantic City and the only reason he is ever allowed to come back is because Tito got him his pass to get back in.

Comment by Mike 04.14.10 @

+ any pretty much any behind-the-scenes rumour relating to the Nas and Jay-Z beef.

Sidenote, that unreleased Eric B & Rakim track Hypnoticalso contains a Kane diss with the absolutely scathing and potentially career ending “I don’t sniff no Kane to get Raw” line.

Comment by MF 04.14.10 @

I read this years ago, Eric B wanted points off a album that Kool G Rap was going to do, on some extortion shit. Kool said no, and this is the source of the rumors. However, people have described Eric B as a baller on the east coast, so there could be some truth to the rumor that Kool absconded because of Eric B.

Comment by Mike 04.14.10 @

leak: russell on dust talked the guys into doin my adidas (dmc was tellin this in a sneaker documentary).

Comment by swordfish 04.14.10 @

I know that Nas working with Illmatic producers not going to happen – that doesn’t mean it wouldn’t be dope. I was just saying that none of those producers have fell off in those 16 years – they are still nice and the result would be too!

Speakin on that – on that recent Peter Rosenberg interview Pete Rock mentioned that Nas picked one of his beats just recently and Primo produced a joint for Nas feat Bun B, so there is something going on.
I’m not surprised if we won’t hear those ever or in case we will, that doesn’t mean he’s back with doing Illmatic again… but it mos def would be a great moment if he ever decides to go back for the whole album

Comment by Blanco 04.14.10 @

leak: russell on dust talked the guys into doin my adidas (dmc was tellin this in a sneaker documentary).


DMC looked/sounded mad messed up in that interview.

Comment by Keyboard K 04.14.10 @

1 – KRS vrs. PM DAWN… rushing the stage was the important part. Who cares about the details.

2 – Rakim career ending BDK? nope… blame the shoulder pads and the broken arm cameo on Don’t Curse.

Comment by CENZI 04.14.10 @

2. Whether credit went to Pete, Puffy or Poke; all of them were just flipping a sample that had already been used before anyway. What exactly did Puff steal from Pete – the idea to steal somebody else’s idea?

Comment by Werner von Wallenrod 04.14.10 @

@ Swordfish. Just for Kicks is the movie. Erick Sermon being the gay rapper, that’s is a another rumour (founded or otherwise) that should be killed as well.

Comment by Crisis 04.14.10 @

I like this whole post and comments..cheers.

Comment by Johnny Hardcore 04.14.10 @

@Mike: Eric B and G Rap were friends for years. G Rap had to move due to a misunderstanding of a different kind altogether.

Comment by Robbie 04.14.10 @

What about the GZA vs Jay Z battle in 94?

Comment by dockevoc 04.14.10 @

@Werner von Wallenrod,

I was going to say the same thing. Teddy Riley and his original version of Wrecks N Effect sampled Juicy also in 89.

As far as Large and Pete Rock…if that rumour is true, then why is Pete so mad at Q-Tip? At least Tip gave credit in the rhyme.

Comment by turtle 04.14.10 @

Ced-Gee from UltraMagnetic used to bang Spinderella from Salt-N-Pepa. Next Plateau’s owner Eddie O’Loughlin was having a contest to find the group a new DJ. Ced sent her ass down there and the rest is history!! It’s funny how this never gets mentioned on there tv bio clips!

Comment by Marc Davis 04.15.10 @

Ced-Gee from UltraMagnetic used to bang Spinderella from Salt-N-Pepa.

Good for him.

Comment by Antonio 04.15.10 @

Ra did diss Kane … despite what Ra says! Go analyze ‘No Competition’ (1st Verse) or ‘Follow The Leader’ (Third Verse)!

“You’re just a rent a rapper, your rhymes are minute maid (as in the JUICE). I’ll be here when you fade and watch you flip like a renegade”.

“No need for speed. Slow down and let the leader lead. Word to DADDY indeed.”

“You said, “You’re COMING but you CAME too late so I wait.” Ref to Raw.

“It’s a danger zone, shoulda arranged his own. Go face it, it’s basic, go race and change you’re tone.” (A slap to Kane and EPMD, but seems to reference similar lines on Kane’s Set It Off).

“No one in my path will withstand. Under pressure the WRATH OF A SWIFT MAN. You name the day when grounds can be mutual, speak your piece the feelings mutual. We can go topic from topic whenever I drop it. Try to stop it. Etc, etc!!!” (ref to Wrath of Kane)

There are other cuts where the disses are a little more cryptic, but they are all over Follow The Leader album.

Don’t bury this important part of Hip Hop History Robbie. It taints the R’s legacy.

Comment by Brock 04.15.10 @

I also feel the disses to LL Cool J on No Omega were glossed over a little too readily by the R in that same Angus Batey interview.

“You need more power you better bring BattleCat (Bob from LA Possee). But this ain’t Gray Skull and you ain’t rippping, Jack!” (a blatant ref to Walk Like a Panther but more imp. Jack The Ripper.

Comment by Brock 04.15.10 @

Jay-Z was an LL Cool J ghostwriter. I realized this listening to the Grey album. I could hear inflections that Cool J had been given by J.

Everyone knows that Cool J came into the game stealing other people’s rhymes. Why you think Rock The Bells was so damn long? He had mad other dude’s lines that’s why.

And that is why Def Jam passed over LL to make Jay the president, even if it was a ceremonial slot. Jay-Z might be a G.I.G. biter, but LL is the dude who had the ghostwriter.

Comment by Dallas Penn 04.15.10 @

Good post.

Comment by ICE MILK A.K.A Trilla Cather 04.15.10 @

…coming up next: Rap Rumors that Matter? I would be interested to see that list too.

Comment by ICE MILK A.K.A Trilla Cather 04.15.10 @

“I see your balls of clay with X vision/ I’m a scientist/Your satelites are weak/they get dimmer everytime I speak”

“There not ready they don’t smell done/like fish it ain’t my favorite dish/I grab a steak in a battle and wish a coke MC or pepsi I sip up/

“Call yourself God/can you make it rain/Can you tell me now what I’m thinking in my brain”

Kool Keith disses to Ra,

“No disctionary necessary to use/big words do nothing but confuse and loose”

“Your potion was weak make another antidote/what’s the science why can’t you quote”

Ra’s response to Kool Keith.

Comment by Marc Davis 04.15.10 @

Rap rumours

1. Khalil from Whodini was the gay rapper (or someone with green eyes) thats where the E-Double rumours came from
2. Big L recorded M.V.P. and as Lord Finesse was working on Biggies album so Puff jacked it and used the sample for One More Chance Remix.
3. Pun wrote Joes rhymes (post Don Cartegena era)
4. Gille wrote Li’ Waynes rhymes
5. Too many ghostwriter/ghost producers rumours since rap was put on wax

Comment by Gold167 04.15.10 @

My favourite quote –

“If you didn’t touch the sampler or the drum machine, you didn’t produce shit.”

Comment by Big Zed 04.15.10 @

Yup, the Ain’t It Good T’Ya record went at Ra something horrible. I loved the sarcasm on that record. It was loaded with refs to Ra!!! Interestingly, what could be construed as Ra’s response, No Competition, apparently got the break from the B-Side of the record that was used by Ultra to diss Ra. This is according to my friend who knows about breaks. Ra realy seemed to home in on Ced Gee on this track. “Bring Along Paramedics, but that won’t help you not even callisthetics …I’m God, G is a 7th letter made. Reigning (raining) on rappers with no parade, so if you ain’t wise then don’t even come. Competition for this and the mixing is none.”

Both classic records!!! Ra and Ultra were the ultimate cryptic dissers of the Golden Era.

Still waiting for evidence of these jabs Kane took at Ra, that Ra always alludes to in interviews. The only jabs I’ve seen taken at Ra came from Cool J and Ultra!

Comment by Brock 04.15.10 @

Brock, the break your talking about is Manzel “space funk”. The begining of the record is what Ultra and Ra used. Most rappers during the golden era were scared of Rakim, point blank. Kool Keith went right in on him and never was scared. The only other person to diss Ra to my knowledge was MC Poet aka Blaq Poet on “All Hells breaking loose”. He went at Ultra, LL, T-La Rock, BDP, & Just-Ice.

This is when rap music was about hardcore competition, originality and attitude!! It stayed on wax and that was it!

Comment by Marc Davis 04.15.10 @

@ Marc! I always wondered if LL dissed Ra on “It Gets No Rougher” with those lines:

“Cos I resent those brothers who slept on, when they shoulda kept on rolling with rush it don’t get no rougher, I snuff a huffer and puffer, a bluffer’ll suffer.” Too cryptic to call.

I miss the battles from the 80’s 90’s periods. It was all about skill, wit and intelligence!

Comment by Brock 04.15.10 @

Speaking of Kool Keith disses, did he ever catch any flack from Five Percenter rappers for that line “call yourself God, can you make it rain”?

Comment by Rah 04.15.10 @

Nah, on the contrary the Five Percenters loved Ultra, especially for there big word play, and the chorus on Ego Trippin’ “Ultra Magnetic Magnetic”. Plus keyboard Money Mike’s brother I-God was one of there main security catz, along with the 9 lives crew, alot of them were Gods.

Comment by Marc Davis 04.16.10 @

Nas will work with preem and LES again. Mark my words.

Comment by Tone 04.16.10 @

large Pro did all of the beats on eric B and rakims Shit

Comment by willdc 04.16.10 @

Didn’t I just read somewhere that Nas is planning on doing an Illmatic 2??

Comment by @StellasKid 04.16.10 @

Also: That alleged Styles line “Rock the boat, rock the boat, just another bitch dead in a rocawear coat”

that shit doesnt exist.

Comment by Eastern_Digital 04.17.10 @

@ Brock : ll and rakim was gonna get into a scuffle in an elevator at one those lines comin from ra, dont surprise me at all.

Comment by jake 04.19.10 @

@ Brock great analysis on those Ra lines off the FTL album going at Kane. But that one supposedly referencing “Wrath of Kane” wouldn’t make sense since the FTL album came out in July ’88 (and obviously recorded in ’87 to early ’88) and “Wrath of Kane” (which was a post Long Live the Kane LP b-side on the reverse of “I’ll Take You There” 12″) did not come out til late ’88, almost ’89.

Comment by mizzensch 04.19.10 @

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